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[8-ball]

"Arriving in Monza as the winner of the last race is a boost"

You did not win anything Felipe but ok does this win make you the new rain master now?

Massa is getting a little arrogant. He is not the best driver in F1 and he knows it. He is only where he is because he is managed by jean todt's son and wins races thanks to the fact he is in the fastest car. Humble pie is in order methinks

[McLaren Fan]

"Arriving in Monza as the winner of the last race is a boost"

You did not win anything Felipe but ok does this win make you the new rain master now?

What a loser. Massa has dropped in my estimation slightly.

[bud]

You know people bag Lewis for his arrogance and what not but i do not think he would even go around talking up "winning" by default like that

and i rekn youre right 8Ball, the Todt connection is a pretty good one for Felipe

[stonemonkey]

I did not like Massa's comments on the Valencia pitlane incident about the other car being a lapped car and should've given way to him in the pitlane (do cars get blue flagged in the pitlane?) and I do not like this, Massa should shut up.

[Matkins]

Makes sense.

If only Hamilton waited.

But there is no way to tell that Hamilton had an unfair advantage. Plus, we are all forgetting that Hamilton did give back the lead a second time, and a gap of a second, albeit by him slipping off the road. Not his fault Raikkonen spun out momentarily after he regained the lead again.

I admit, I have had a couple of "what-if" thoughts. But then, bud was kind to remind everybody that IF Hamilton still maintained momentum, he lost it all we he ended up in the grass 10 seconds later. And he slowed down considerably then. But, as soon as Raikkonen regained the lead, he spun out.

In my opinion, and no one, NO ONE AT ALL CAN ARGUE THIS, any "momentum" gained by Hamilton, IF ANY, was cancelled out by the incident later on. You cannot justify a penalty, on MOMENTUM.

Especially when Raikkonen gained the lead a second time. The incident at the bus stop is QUESTIONABLE, but no one can argue that point above. NOBODY.

Forget about the penalty for a moment. Concentrating on Lewis Hamilton himself, he needs to get more maturity. I think with experience this will come. In reality there were still 2 and half long laps to go and Kimi could not hold off Lewis Hamilton. Had he just waited a little longer he would of passed Kimi anyway. He would of done so cleanly as well and no penalty of this sort would of even ever been passed. Regardless of what happens with the appeal, this can certainly be treated as a positive learning step for the always maturing Lewis Hamilton.

With all due respect AKR, we want to watch racing, not waiting.
Also, as someone else has already said in another thread, no one can see the future. For all Hamilton knew that was his one and only chance to get past, and he rightfully took it in my, and most other peoples, opinions. Even Charlie Whiting at the time said fair game, race on.

As for Felipe Massa's comment about Hamilton only "partially" giving the place back to Raikkonen, in the words of the wise Pablo Montoya, "What a f@cking idiot".

[onelapdown]

I see where you're coming from AKR, but I think in his mind Hamilton had done quite enough to redress the balance with Raikkonen. He shouldn't have to drive with the mindset of "I'm bound to get shafted by the stewards so I need to go out of my way to placate them." One of Hamilton's comments from straight after was interesting, I think he said something about not giving Raikkonen too much advantage because THAT would be unfair, and from the point of view of someone who's just been pushed off the track I can see exactly what he means.

[IceManpjn]

"Arriving in Monza as the winner of the last race is a boost"

Wait..., Massa really said that? That's kinda pretentious considering he was only the third-best driver of the day, behind both Hamilton and teammate Räikkönen and the only reason he sits in first is that one of his superiors crashed and the other got demoted two positions. Yes, I like Massa's performance during the past several races, but he was still only the third-best man on that track Sunday.

[Denthúl]

“What Lewis did is the sort of thing that can happen, but I think he was maybe a bit too optimistic in thinking he could just hand back the position, albeit only partially to Kimi and then immediately try and pass him again," Massa said on Ferrari's official website. “Incidents like this have often been discussed in the official driver briefings when it has been made absolutely clear that anyone cutting a chicane has to fully restore the position and also any other eventual advantage gained."

Why couldn't Felipe just keep his mouth shut? The more I see of the guy, the more I like him, and my opinion of him has gone up and up this year, but this is one of those situations where he should have just said nothing and let it pan out. He has a view which is reasonable and backed up by an argument, fair enough, but he now opens himself up to the argument that he is happy to win the Championship by having Hamilton penalised, which doesn't help him at all.

The fact that it is from Ferrari's website leads me to question how much of this is his own view and how much is Ferrari playing politics, but really it would be better for all concerned if the drivers were left out of it.

I'd say it was mostly from Ferrari's press-room, because that's very out-of-character for Felipe. He's usually the first guy to accept that he wasn't good enough on a day where he gets beaten, and that he has to work harder in order to continue to fight for the championship.

[Mikep99]

Here is Alonso view

Guess who else supports Lewis Hamilton’s penalty? (Clue: he’s a current F1 driver)

http://www.gridcrasher.com/index.php/2008/09/10/guess-who-else-loves-lewis-hamiltons-penalty-clue-hes-a-current-f1-driver

When Fernando Alonso heard about Lewis Hamilton’s penalty, he probably laughed like a cartoon villain. It’s not that the Spaniard hate Lewis - in fact, the two are friendly enough around the paddock, even if they have never been genuine buddies. It’s more to do with Nando’s belief that McLaren (Ron Dennis, to be specific) f**ked him over and set his career back by several seasons.


Having won a second world title in 2006, Alonso would have expected himself to be a triple world champ by the end of the 2008 season, maybe even a quadruple champ - he was Michael Schumacher’s natural heir, after all. Instead, he’s stuck in a mid-table car, scrapping for points. Even the most ardent of McLaren fans can see why he might now be a tad biased against the team.

So it’s no surprise to hear Nando’s opinion on the Spa penalty scandal: “In the end, what they say is always fair, whether you like it or not,” he told Spain’s Cadena SER radio station.

Not one driver has come out and backed Lewis/McLaren yet. Conspiracy or not, seems there’s a shortage of love for Messrs Dennis, Hamilton and Whitmarsh in the F1 paddock.

Found this part interesting

Not one driver has come out and backed Lewis/McLaren yet. Conspiracy or not, seems there’s a shortage of love for Messrs Dennis, Hamilton and Whitmarsh in the F1 paddock

[onelapdown]

Not one driver has come out and backed Lewis/McLaren yet. Conspiracy or not, seems there’s a shortage of love for Messrs Dennis, Hamilton and Whitmarsh in the F1 paddock

In the same way that no driver apart from Webber said Moseley should go. It simply isn't worth the hassle for them but it doesn't indicate a preference one way or another.

[bud]

Found this part interesting

Not one driver has come out and backed Lewis/McLaren yet. Conspiracy or not, seems there’s a shortage of love for Messrs Dennis, Hamilton and Whitmarsh in the F1 paddock

plenty of drivers have!

[f1usa]

Makes sense.

If only Hamilton waited.

But there is no way to tell that Hamilton had an unfair advantage. Plus, we are all forgetting that Hamilton did give back the lead a second time, and a gap of a second, albeit by him slipping off the road. Not his fault Raikkonen spun out momentarily after he regained the lead again.

I admit, I have had a couple of "what-if" thoughts. But then, bud was kind to remind everybody that IF Hamilton still maintained momentum, he lost it all we he ended up in the grass 10 seconds later. And he slowed down considerably then. But, as soon as Raikkonen regained the lead, he spun out.

In my opinion, and no one, NO ONE AT ALL CAN ARGUE THIS, any "momentum" gained by Hamilton, IF ANY, was cancelled out by the incident later on. You cannot justify a penalty, on MOMENTUM.

Especially when Raikkonen gained the lead a second time. The incident at the bus stop is QUESTIONABLE, but no one can argue that point above. NOBODY.

Forget about the penalty for a moment. Concentrating on Lewis Hamilton himself, he needs to get more maturity. I think with experience this will come. In reality there were still 2 and half long laps to go and Kimi could not hold off Lewis Hamilton. Had he just waited a little longer he would of passed Kimi anyway. He would of done so cleanly as well and no penalty of this sort would of even ever been passed. Regardless of what happens with the appeal, this can certainly be treated as a positive learning step for the always maturing Lewis Hamilton.

Maturity has nothing to do with it, Lewis wanted to be leading race before the bottom fell out of the sky. Also, there were some drivers on intermediate wets closing the gap to Kimi and Lewis. LH is a better wet weather driver than Kimi.

[juggles]

"Arriving in Monza as the winner of the last race is a boost"

You did not win anything Felipe but ok does this win make you the new rain master now?

What a stupid thing to say. Clearly completely intentional; I guess he has to address his insecurities about Hamilton being a far superior driver in some way. I was starting to like Massa, but this just gave me a wake up call.

[Big Azza]

"Arriving in Monza as the winner of the last race is a boost"

You did not win anything Felipe but ok does this win make you the new rain master now?

What a stupid thing to say. Clearly completely intentional; I guess he has to address his insecurities about Hamilton being a far superior driver in some way. I was starting to like Massa, but this just gave me a wake up call.