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[vaptin]

I think if Alonso is third, and its a redbull 1-2 in the last two races with Vettel leading them, Alonso gets the WDC?

Yep, but if Webber wins one of those 1-2's then he wins the WDC.
If Alonso's has a 6th and a win in the last two races he wins the WDC no matter what anyone else does.

Cool, its just thats the main situation for redbull needing to use team orders in Brazil, is it really worth just hoping Alonso will either drop off or that they'll get another 1-2 in Abu Dhabi. Of course the situation where they pretty much have to IMO is Alonso ahead of the redbulls with Vettel leading Webber in Brazil.

[spankyham]

Consistently lenient? What do you mean? Ferrari have been the only team to be up on team order charges.

I think McLaren were charged with Team Orders in Monaco in '07

[FRAFPDD]

Consistently lenient? What do you mean? Ferrari have been the only team to be up on team order charges.

I think McLaren were charged with Team Orders in Monaco in '07

who was the benefactor?

[spankyham]

Consistently lenient? What do you mean? Ferrari have been the only team to be up on team order charges.

I think McLaren were charged with Team Orders in Monaco in '07

who was the benefactor?

According to the stewards no-one

[FRAFPDD]

Consistently lenient? What do you mean? Ferrari have been the only team to be up on team order charges.

I think McLaren were charged with Team Orders in Monaco in '07

who was the benefactor?

According to the stewards no-one

good answer mate lol, im busted

[bud]

Consistently lenient? What do you mean? Ferrari have been the only team to be up on team order charges.

I think McLaren were charged with Team Orders in Monaco in '07

They were not charged with anything.

[spankyham]

Consistently lenient? What do you mean? Ferrari have been the only team to be up on team order charges.

I think McLaren were charged with Team Orders in Monaco in '07

They were not charged with anything.

Stewards at the race investigated a Team Order charge against McLaren:-

[bud]

Exactly no charges were laid! Ferrari on the otherhand were punished for team orders! Albeit pathetically

I always find Monaco 07 funny as I thought Lewis was meant to be favoured that year, this race proves otherwise as Fernando was meant to have been favoured which the FIA threw out!

[Big Azza]

I dont get why the talk is now, red bull must favour webber for a hope in securing the title, correct me if im wrong but red bull have had 1-2 on the grid for about 14 races this year? Why is brazil and abu dhabi going to be any different, alonso has iirc a 10 point lead over webber, and if webber finishes 1st and second in the next two, and alonso finishes say second and third, doesnt webber win, this isnt to mention the fact that a mclaren (probably lewis to be fair) could easily get infront of alonso in the next tworace qualifying(s ?) alonso is the most calm guy under pressure ive ever seen in my f1 watching time and the fact that hes coming out in interviews saying tis far from over with only two races left and ten points and momentum on webber shows that he knows he hasnt got an easy ride by any means, even two more podiums might not see him win the title. Just sayin we shouldnt all give up on this years championship, look how quickly lewis was leading and then not, then webber and alonso, infact jenson and vettel too, i think this has to go down to abu dhabi and there are four drivers still in it i think.

How many races has Vettel led this year? Almost all of them. All his mistakes and reliability problems come when he is leading the race. He honestly should have 4 more wins this season. Probably even more than that. Vettel is a better pick to win out of the Red Bulls. Webber is just plain lucky. Webber would be lucky to finish second at both of the remaining races in my honest opinion.

Vettel on the other hand is very unlucky. But he is clearly the better driver, clearly fastest. With Kubica and Hamilton and Rosberg and Schumacher in the mix, Alonso has his work cut out for him to even finish third.

In my opinion Vettel has a better chance to win the championship. He is a safer bet too. And he actually deserves it which may come as a surprise to everyone here. So many pole positions, so many fast laps.... So many races led, he honestly deserves it and has rotten luck. I know we're discussing it elsewhere, but I just think Red Bull would be crazy to throw all their support behind Webber.

And I think it's a better bet that Vettel will win the remaining Grand Prix than Alonso finishing 3rd at both Grand Prixs... Am I crazy?

[spankyham]

Exactly no charges were laid! Ferrari on the otherhand were punished for team orders! Albeit pathetically

The charge was laid to be investigated by the RD/Steward after the race. That is why the document exists. In the case of McLaren, the FiA through its officials accepted McLaren's defense.
I was responding to the supposition raised that no other team had been investigated for Team Orders. I simply pointed out that McLaren was investigated for exactly this at Monaco 07. McLaren got a favourable result Ferrari didn't.

I always find Monaco 07 funny as I thought Lewis was meant to be favoured that year, this race proves otherwise as Fernando was meant to have been favoured which the FIA threw out!

You and I both know that, at the latest, by China McLaren were favouring Lewis so much that Ron Dennis went on public record stating "they" were racing against Fernando - not Kimi. Now you can say that it was because it was "understood" that Fernando was leaving the team, but it doesn't change the fact that Fernando had to, at least for the last two races, race against Hamilton and the McLaren team. The fact that even against those incredible odds that they ended the season on the same points and wins is, IMO, a fantastic effort by Fernando.

[texasmr2]

Webber is just plain lucky.
Vettel on the other hand is very unlucky.

So your admitting that luck does play apart in winning a WDC!! You mentioned something about 'so many pole positions and fast laps' what about racecraft and maturity behind the wheel? Vettel would be ahead of Webber in the WDC standings if he had the qualities that Webber has, not that he won't, but the proof is in the pudding don't you think?

Oh and YES you are crazy but thats what makes your post so amusing .

[spankyham]

And I think it's a better bet that Vettel will win the remaining Grand Prix than Alonso finishing 3rd at both Grand Prixs... Am I crazy?

For asking "Am I crazy" Ans=yes
For your thoughts that Vettel could win both races, definitely not. He's a very good and fast driver and he's learning all the time.

[bud]

Fernando dug his own hole in the team spanky, you should realize that in brazil the FIA (due to a Spanish official) brought in a fair play observer and found no favoritism.
Thought by now you would also know about Ron Speak?

[Big Azza]

And I think it's a better bet that Vettel will win the remaining Grand Prix than Alonso finishing 3rd at both Grand Prixs... Am I crazy?

For asking "Am I crazy" Ans=yes
For your thoughts that Vettel could win both races, definitely not. He's a very good and fast driver and he's learning all the time.

I'm going to put my mortgage on it.

Webber is just plain lucky.
Vettel on the other hand is very unlucky.

So your admitting that luck does play apart in winning a WDC!! You mentioned something about 'so many pole positions and fast laps' what about racecraft and maturity behind the wheel? Vettel would be ahead of Webber in the WDC standings if he had the qualities that Webber has, not that he won't, but the proof is in the pudding don't you think?

Oh and YES you are crazy but thats what makes your post so amusing .

Did I ever say luck didn't play a part? I'm expecting you to say yes here as well, but in my opinion Vettel deserves it and yeah he's in this position because of his own doing. But I can think of 5 Grand Prixs he should have won. That is unprecedented.

[texasmr2]

And I think it's a better bet that Vettel will win the remaining Grand Prix than Alonso finishing 3rd at both Grand Prixs... Am I crazy?

For asking "Am I crazy" Ans=yes
For your thoughts that Vettel could win both races, definitely not. He's a very good and fast driver and he's learning all the time.

I'm going to put my mortgage on it.

Webber is just plain lucky.
Vettel on the other hand is very unlucky.

So your admitting that luck does play apart in winning a WDC!! You mentioned something about 'so many pole positions and fast laps' what about racecraft and maturity behind the wheel? Vettel would be ahead of Webber in the WDC standings if he had the qualities that Webber has, not that he won't, but the proof is in the pudding don't you think?

Oh and YES you are crazy but thats what makes your post so amusing .

Did I ever say luck didn't play a part? I'm expecting you to say yes here as well, but in my opinion Vettel deserves it and yeah he's in this position because of his own doing. But I can think of 5 Grand Prixs he should have won. That is unprecedented.

Should of, would of, could of does not make a WDC. Vettel does not deserve a daym thing just because he 'should have won 5 GP's'.