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[Jabberwocky]

So after many thousands of miles travelled, many thousands of miles raced, millions of pounds spent. It comes down to an unpaid marshal who was at the pit lane exit to decide the championship... Is he a Ferrari or Redbull fan?

using phone, so beware of predictive text errors.

[Hammer278]

Who the hell wants to win a championship in a courtroom?

Ferrari and Alonso's favourite way to win anyway.

[LewEngBridewell]

Who the hell wants to win a championship in a courtroom?

Precisely!

[mnmracer]

I can't argue with you GRHinPorts because we simply can not see, it seems to me that Senna was half way alongside, until we see an external replay of the incident, neither of us know!

On a separate occasion, Vettel appears to overtake a Toro Rosso under yellows.

[youtube]MZHaBuaA9oQ[/youtube]

Vettel definitely overtook before the green electronic flag board on the left, I believe the rule is that a driver has to be past the electronic flag board before overtaking?

Correct me if I am wrong!?!?

It's been talked to death on other forums, so I'm not going to go into too much detail, but he was actually green-flagged by a marshall post in between the two lights.


Although it's very grainy (as all the footage is really, is this 2012!?), onboard shots from Alonso show that if it was a yellow flag, it would be very easily distinguishable. As it's not, and there was no reason for a blue flag, it must be a green flag (powers of deduction ftw!).

Not every marshall post has a light, but every flag signal still counts; they have precedence over any electronic signal.
Manual flags are just not translated to the steering wheel (how could they), but he overtook under the green flag of the marshall post near the pit exit.

[mnmracer]

Perhaps Fernando should remember what he had to say in 2007:

Fernando Alonso believes it would be bad for Formula One if Lewis Hamilton was handed the world championship title via post-race disqualifications.

Speaking after news of the investigation into the BMWs and Williams broke, Alonso said Formula One's reputation would be damaged if Raikkonen lost the title because Hamilton was retrospectively promoted to fourth.

"It would be a joke, and we've had too many already," he told Spanish radio station Cadena Ser. "If something like that happened, it would end up burying the sport." -source

[What's Burning?]

We can argue this till we're blue in the face, but the video Mr. Incredible posted on the previous page is cut and dry, Vettel passed a Toro Rosso car under yellow flag conditions. Whether anything should be done about it is something else entirely but there is no debate about the fact that he did make an illegal pass.

[LRW]

We can argue this till we're blue in the face, but the video Mr. Incredible posted on the previous page is cut and dry, Vettel passed a Toro Rosso car under yellow flag conditions. Whether anything should be done about it is something else entirely but there is no debate about the fact that he did make an illegal pass.

But they ARE debating the facts. They think there was a manual green flag just after the pit exit (before the point of overtake). This flag would take priority over whatever his dash was showing. However, contrary to what others think, I don't think the onboard is conclusive to see what flag, if any, was being waved.

Either way I don't think anything will come of it.

[What's Burning?]

We can argue this till we're blue in the face, but the video Mr. Incredible posted on the previous page is cut and dry, Vettel passed a Toro Rosso car under yellow flag conditions. Whether anything should be done about it is something else entirely but there is no debate about the fact that he did make an illegal pass.

But they ARE debating the facts. They think there was a manual green flag just after the pit exit (before the point of overtake). This flag would take priority over whatever his dash was showing. However, contrary to what others think, I don't think the onboard is conclusive to see what flag, if any, was being waved.

Either way I don't think anything will come of it.

I agree, let sleeping dogs lie. It would also be hypocritical of Alonso to accept the title and I don't believe any driver would pursue a litigated win but wouldn't THAT be the ultimate in team orders? Ferrari pushing the issue?

[vlad]

Waved flag outrules the electronic light, it says so in the rules. What is the problem here, Vettel attacked as soon as he passed the waved flag. Clean move.

Who the hell wants to win a championship in a courtroom?

Ferrari and Alonso's favourite way to win anyway.

Yeah, it was expected. I was surprised they didn't do it earlier...

[racechick]

It's not a nice way to win the championship. But if Vettel overtook under yellows.........well that's not a nice way for Alonso to lose it either. Difficult. The powers that be have a habit of getting themselves into messes.

[mnmracer]

[vlad]

Hahahaha, nice one!!!



Anyway, here's the message of a guy that actually works as a race marshal:
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/groups/f1/forum/topic/youtube-analysis-vettels-yellow-flag-overtakes/?topic_page=5&num=15#post-81011

[RichardC]

Is it not fairly apparent that the Torro Rosso slows down dramatically in an effort to allow the RedBull to pass (like they did on a couple of occasions on raceday)? If they are to fight this then surely their only viable "excuse" is that Vettel shouldn't be hindered by a far slower car even under yellow flags.

Kind of crappy way for a good season to finish to be honest. Regardless of who is victorious in the upcoming protest, this seasons winner will be forever marred with the "But did they really win?" controversy.

[vlad]

I don't see any debate going on even after 1 or 2 years, there is NO controversy here, except the Ferrari appeal itself.

[LewEngBridewell]

Kind of crappy way for a good season to finish to be honest. Regardless of who is victorious in the upcoming protest, this seasons winner will be forever marred with the "But did they really win?" controversy.

Yes, I'll be pretty p!ssed if all this casts a shadow over what has been a great year of racing.