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[PartsaS]

great video, I can't wait to see him in a decent F1 car

[darwin dali]

great video, I can't wait to see him in a decent F1 car

A bit harsh

Sauber has a decent F1 car!

[vlad]

Nice video! It reminds me of Vettel this year at Spa. WHen you know you are good in a slow corner like that, USE IT!

[LewEngBridewell]

Teams' fortunes go up and down, why can some people not GRASP this? Before we start comparing title-stats over the last 10 years, and sending hail-marys in the direction of Williams, Ferrari and RBR, let's just analyse where each of these teams are at the moment, and where they were at intervals of 2 or 3 years going back. It's never constant.

[andrew]

Comparing teams from year to year is as stupid as trying to work out the best driver ever.

You can only have the best, 2nd best, 3rd beast etc etc in any one season.

[f1ea]

Resources are now restricted though, Redbull are spending as much as anyone, which helps to explain their success, F1 is great for their branding, it fits in, which is why they invested so heavily.

McLaren are now privateers, they need money, the economic downturn has had a negative impact on their sponsorship opportunities, and they wanted to save money on driver's wages and Hamilton's contract was up for renewal, driver wages being an exception to spending caps, McLaren can't really compete with Mercedes in the ability to throw money at Hamilton.

But they threw iat Button
But its a mute point anyway, hamilton didnt chase the money.

Well come now RC... I'm sure he wasn't chasing the money but he also didn't take a pay cut out of the deal.

Totally correct.
Brawn talks about the salary being similar as if thats the only way they get money. It's obvious he's going to make more money at Merc.

Whether they are calling it "image freedom" or whether he's gone to Merc to win its a completely different thing. Unrelated to be honest.

So i dont see where racechick is going by saying they threw the money at Jenson; while tooting the equal treatment nonsense. i though you (racechick) professed the whole driver equality BS as a moral obligation, above the rules of the sport. Well, salary is a good way to start isnt it?

Have you honestly professed driver equality?

I say no. You've been double standared all along.

[racechick]

Resources are now restricted though, Redbull are spending as much as anyone, which helps to explain their success, F1 is great for their branding, it fits in, which is why they invested so heavily.

McLaren are now privateers, they need money, the economic downturn has had a negative impact on their sponsorship opportunities, and they wanted to save money on driver's wages and Hamilton's contract was up for renewal, driver wages being an exception to spending caps, McLaren can't really compete with Mercedes in the ability to throw money at Hamilton.

But they threw iat Button
But its a mute point anyway, hamilton didnt chase the money.

Well come now RC... I'm sure he wasn't chasing the money but he also didn't take a pay cut out of the deal.

Totally correct.
Brawn talks about the salary being similar as if thats the only way they get money. It's obvious he's going to make more money at Merc.

Whether they are calling it "image freedom" or whether he's gone to Merc to win its a completely different thing. Unrelated to be honest.

So i dont see where racechick is going by saying they threw the money at Jenson; while tooting the equal treatment nonsense. i though you (racechick) professed the whole driver equality BS as a moral obligation, above the rules of the sport. Well, salary is a good way to start isnt it?

Have you honestly professed driver equality?

I say no. You've been double standared all along.

Not sure what you mean here? Yes I prefer equal driver status and have said so lots of times. Button and Hamilton are on the same salary and Mclaren in May said Lewis would be taking a pay cut in the region of have his salary. That would have put him on half of Buttons (Button only having signed in the previous November. That was a massive salary hike for Button.

Since then, when Mclaren realised belatedly that they weren't Lewis' only option, they matched the offer of Mercedes, but by then Lewis was sold on the mercedes package. Lewis never asked for and hasnt been given number one status -so Im not sure what your getting at?
He has asked that he be given eqaulity and be more involved in the engineering side of things. (something he obviosly felt strogly about and wasnt happy with at McLaren)

So what with the double standards? Im at a loss.

[f1ea]

Considering none of us have seen the offers. I dont think we can really say the half salary option was even brought fwd.

Secondly, you have strongly voiced your opinion that Mclaren prefer Button, yet from the latest offers we have seen, they were never very far in terms of pay (in this instance)... however, get to keep the trophies, have the Mclaren F1 supercar etc... Was it Part of ther contracts? I dont know. So really... only thing we do know was the last Mclaren offer (the only one that has been publicly spoken for) was pretty equal. But yet you continue to drown in the whole bromance thing.

To me, you were just expecting Mclaren to go out of their ways to keep a driver, which has given them..... well, how many WCC pts have they claimed vs the WDC pts he's given the team? Today Mcl is 2nd in WCC, Lewis is 4th in WDC. The way i see it, he hasn't given that much more than he has been given.

So. If he didn't like the offer, and you agree he was being mistreated. Pretty much with the same offer (actually, probably better in many ways) than that of Jenson's.... If you say Mclaren didnt treat him the way he deserved, despite it being pretty close to the way they treat Jenson.... What were you expecting?? Significantly better treatmet, significantly better salary? That doesnt sound very equal to me.

[racechick]

To be honest I didnt want Mclaren to go out of their way to keep Lewis, I was hoping he'd fly the nest.
No we may not be truelly privvy to the exact deals, but I think we can get the gist.
I dont think they did treat them equally. I think it was clear Whitmarsh preferred Jenson and was happier when he won. Lewis seems to feel he didnt have as much of a hand in development as he'd have liked , but I wouldn't have wanted lewis as number one. No. Just equal, as he wants. Thats not to say, if near the end of the season he had a chance at the title and Jenson didnt I 'd expect Jenson to support, same if it was the other way round.
They're equal at mercedes and Im glad. I felt uneasy when the first reports said he'd been given number one status, but that was incorrect. Brawn has said Lewis never asked, it was never discussed. Lewis just insisted on parity. Which is as it should be.

[Hammer278]

Funny to see you having a proper go at McLaren in that way now Hammer, when i have seen you slate Mercedes for costing Raikkonen the title in 2005. What's changed? (rhetorical question!)

Mercedes engines have changed! They've been the best engines the past few seasons now.

[f1ea]

To be honest I didnt want Mclaren to go out of their way to keep Lewis, I was hoping he'd fly the nest.

Ok, good.

No we may not be truelly privvy to the exact deals, but I think we can get the gist.

Get the gist?
Nope, i don't.

I dont think they did treat them equally. I think it was clear Whitmarsh preferred Jenson and was happier when he won.

Really? It was clear ?
How come not even Lewis has said he wasnt treated equal? The team say they do. It seems like they do. But you THINK they don't. Sorry... I don't trust your judgement on this one. Prove me wrong.

Lewis seems to feel he didnt have as much of a hand in development as he'd have liked , but I wouldn't have wanted lewis as number one. No. Just equal, as he wants.

According to the team... They designed this and next yr's car, base on him being the team. This yr's car was effectively adjusted to suit him better than it did at first.
What more would you want... that would be EQUAL?

Thats not to say, if near the end of the season he had a chance at the title and Jenson didnt I 'd expect Jenson to support, same if it was the other way round..

No. You say they should be allowed to race. Should i dig for old quotes?
Also, did Jenson ask for any support last yr? Did he get any?

They're equal at mercedes and Im glad. I felt uneasy when the first reports said he'd been given number one status, but that was incorrect. Brawn has said Lewis never asked, it was never discussed. Lewis just insisted on parity. Which is as it should be.

Really!? You have seen the future?
You have seen the PRIVATE & CONFIDENTIAL contracts???

You do realize that ANYTHING written in those contracts and proposals is absolutely confidential. They CAN'T say what's in them. So.... Besides we not really knowing what it will be like. I will give them the benefit of the doubt. Despite you not giving it to Mclaren. Hmmm funny.

[LewEngBridewell]

Funny to see you having a proper go at McLaren in that way now Hammer, when i have seen you slate Mercedes for costing Raikkonen the title in 2005. What's changed? (rhetorical question!)

Mercedes engines have changed! They've been the best engines the past few seasons now.

Shame about the chassis.

[racechick]

To be honest I didnt want Mclaren to go out of their way to keep Lewis, I was hoping he'd fly the nest.

Ok, good.

No we may not be truelly privvy to the exact deals, but I think we can get the gist.

Get the gist?
Nope, i don't.

I dont think they did treat them equally. I think it was clear Whitmarsh preferred Jenson and was happier when he won.

Really? It was clear ?
How come not even Lewis has said he wasnt treated equal? The team say they do. It seems like they do. But you THINK they don't. Sorry... I don't trust your judgement on this one. Prove me wrong.

Lewis seems to feel he didnt have as much of a hand in development as he'd have liked , but I wouldn't have wanted lewis as number one. No. Just equal, as he wants.

According to the team... They designed this and next yr's car, base on him being the team. This yr's car was effectively adjusted to suit him better than it did at first.
What more would you want... that would be EQUAL?

Thats not to say, if near the end of the season he had a chance at the title and Jenson didnt I 'd expect Jenson to support, same if it was the other way round..

No. You say they should be allowed to race. Should i dig for old quotes?
Also, did Jenson ask for any support last yr? Did he get any?

They're equal at mercedes and Im glad. I felt uneasy when the first reports said he'd been given number one status, but that was incorrect. Brawn has said Lewis never asked, it was never discussed. Lewis just insisted on parity. Which is as it should be.

Really!? You have seen the future?
You have seen the PRIVATE & CONFIDENTIAL contracts???

You do realize that ANYTHING written in those contracts and proposals is absolutely confidential. They CAN'T say what's in them. So.... Besides we not really knowing what it will be like. I will give them the benefit of the doubt. Despite you not giving it to Mclaren. Hmmm funny.

Cant be arsed to answer all those split up quotes, believe what you will. We all base our thoughts on what we see and read and believe. You think differenrtly, thats fine by me.

[f1ea]

To be honest I didnt want Mclaren to go out of their way to keep Lewis, I was hoping he'd fly the nest.

Ok, good.

No we may not be truelly privvy to the exact deals, but I think we can get the gist.

Get the gist?
Nope, i don't.

I dont think they did treat them equally. I think it was clear Whitmarsh preferred Jenson and was happier when he won.

Really? It was clear ?
How come not even Lewis has said he wasnt treated equal? The team say they do. It seems like they do. But you THINK they don't. Sorry... I don't trust your judgement on this one. Prove me wrong.

Lewis seems to feel he didnt have as much of a hand in development as he'd have liked , but I wouldn't have wanted lewis as number one. No. Just equal, as he wants.

According to the team... They designed this and next yr's car, base on him being the team. This yr's car was effectively adjusted to suit him better than it did at first.
What more would you want... that would be EQUAL?

Thats not to say, if near the end of the season he had a chance at the title and Jenson didnt I 'd expect Jenson to support, same if it was the other way round..

No. You say they should be allowed to race. Should i dig for old quotes?
Also, did Jenson ask for any support last yr? Did he get any?

They're equal at mercedes and Im glad. I felt uneasy when the first reports said he'd been given number one status, but that was incorrect. Brawn has said Lewis never asked, it was never discussed. Lewis just insisted on parity. Which is as it should be.

Really!? You have seen the future?
You have seen the PRIVATE & CONFIDENTIAL contracts???

You do realize that ANYTHING written in those contracts and proposals is absolutely confidential. They CAN'T say what's in them. So.... Besides we not really knowing what it will be like. I will give them the benefit of the doubt. Despite you not giving it to Mclaren. Hmmm funny.

Cant be arsed to answer all those split up quotes, believe what you will. We all base our thoughts on what we see and read and believe. You think differenrtly, thats fine by me.

You could try just 1 at least

[racechick]

No. You say they should be allowed to race. Should i dig for old quotes?
Also, did Jenson ask for any support last yr? Did he get any?

Ok just the one. You can dig for old quotes if you want. I do believe they should be allowerd to race. But at the end of the season if one driver is way behind I think he should help the other.
Last year Vettel was a country mile down the road at the end of the season, there was no helping Button to that title.
And you realise this is the wrong thread? If you want to continue you should be in the Lewis thread.