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[bud]

he didnt let him pass Lewis was lapping faster, he would have passed him as he passed both Massa and Piquet. What he did was not put up a fight. remember Lewis was the leader up until the SC ruined that. Alonso on the other hand was trading laps with Massa even on the hards when Alonso was apparently faster Massa was matching and bettering him.

Look at it this way.

Did McLaren stop Heikki from winning? No, Lewis was the only driver fast enough in the team to win.

Did Ferrari stop Massa from winning? Yes!! Was Alonso faster? if he was why not pass him as Lewis showed you can pass at the track with a faster car.

difference again Scotty

[SaintDean]

Must say people are really taking this to a new level. I will only make a few points, which actually summarizes what happened and if its wrong or not.

1) The rule says no team orders.
2) Nothing about what time during the season, its just not allowed.
3) Says nothing about if he could have made the pass or could not. Its just not allowed.
4) Nobody said Massa needed to let him pass, yes you might read through the lines. But the wording was not used.
5) Alonso never said that Massa needed to let him pass.
6) Alonso was catching Massa quickly, he was 3.5 sec behind and it was now down to 0.8 sec. He would have made a move if Massa had not let him pass. This could have resulted in a crash similar to Red Bull in Turkey.
7) Other teams have used/still use team orders, and not got punished (Hamilton 2008 f. instance).
All the teams are companies, and spend several hundred millions per season. They need to enhance their chances of winning, therefore let the driver with best chance to win the title have some advantages. Alonso did not have these advantages in the beginning of the season. Now its time to focus on one driver. As McLaren should have done in 2007.
9) Ferrari can be punished, the Alonso can not as he did not do anything wrong.

and finally, ask yourself this

Are you angry because Massa and his engineer made it so oblivious or is it because its Ferrari and Alonso? Because surely most of you did not react like this when Hamilton got all the advantages over Heikki Kovalainen in 2008.

In my opinion team orders must be allowed as it is in most other sports (running, cycling etc). If one car helps you, there are still 22 others you need to beat.

These days people have common sense.

[AnotherOpinion]

F1 IS NOT A TEAM SPORT

Why do people call F1 a team sport ?

The only trophy that matters to the fans is the Drivers Championship and this can only be won individually. I thought the object of the sport is to have the drivers compete to determine who was the best driver otherwise they might as well stick remote controls on the cars and see which is the fastest car, whith this in mind I think the concept of team oredrs should be unacceptable.

Because there is a team competition, and the driver doesn't get out to change his tires.

OK On Race Day the team is made up of the driver and his mechanics which means the other car in theory should belong to a different team i.e Massa and Alonso should be in different teams who both have one sponsor

[darwin dali]

F1 IS NOT A TEAM SPORT

Why do people call F1 a team sport ?

The only trophy that matters to the fans is the Drivers Championship and this can only be won individually. I thought the object of the sport is to have the drivers compete to determine who was the best driver otherwise they might as well stick remote controls on the cars and see which is the fastest car, whith this in mind I think the concept of team oredrs should be unacceptable.

Because there is a team competition, and the driver doesn't get out to change his tires.

OK On Race Day the team is made up of the driver and his mechanics which means the other car in theory should belong to a different team i.e Massa and Alonso should be in different teams who both have one sponsor

I want some of what you are smoking

[AnotherOpinion]

F1 IS NOT A TEAM SPORT

Why do people call F1 a team sport ?

The only trophy that matters to the fans is the Drivers Championship and this can only be won individually. I thought the object of the sport is to have the drivers compete to determine who was the best driver otherwise they might as well stick remote controls on the cars and see which is the fastest car, whith this in mind I think the concept of team oredrs should be unacceptable.

Because there is a team competition, and the driver doesn't get out to change his tires.

OK On Race Day the team is made up of the driver and his mechanics which means the other car in theory should belong to a different team i.e Massa and Alonso should be in different teams who both have one sponsor

I want some of what you are smoking

In racehorsing An owner has more than one horse competing in a race would yo call this a team sport ? is he allowed to pass messages to other jockeys to slow down and let his other horses win wouldn't you call this race fixing which is exatly what happened yesterday !!

[Ineluke]

in both the above instances Ferrari never gave the order over the radio, both drivers knew the stakes pre race talks about scenarios of the points and gladly moved over on their own accord. I can guarantee before the race Massa thought he had every shot at winning the race the call from Smedley would have been a stake through the heart!

exactly the knife was to Smedlys neck when he was saying that he was absoulty gutted for his driver.

They need to throw the book at Ferrari to prevent this happening again.

@VB
As for Mclaren doing this If your refering to 2008 Silverstone or 2008 Hockenhiem they were actual overtakes rather than a radio team order.

I'm just saying sports is all based on favouritism, if you believe you have a higher chance of suceeding? Then go for it.

Example


Football -

One player has scored 6 goals based on penalties

the other has scored 2 goals based on penalties

You are obviously going to let the 6 goal man go for it. This will happen for years to come, its strategic which F1 IS BASED ON!!!

So all of your team has done it, And for EJ? For sake!

He is a bare faced liar, he used favouritism when Ralf & Damon were racing, if the rules were illegal or not, favouritism will always play a 20% factor in racing.

The only team it can't be a factor in is McLaren!!!
Jenson & Lewis are both great drivers and can't be split.

RBR -
They are both egotistic maniacs who both want to be on the front and back of the paper. That leads to crashes and tears.

Jenson and Lewis can't be split! what a load of bs. Where was. Jenson this weekend when he started in front of. Lewis.
Anyway,the fact remains alonso the cheating red rat along with his cheating team broke the rules.
I wonder if you would have the same reactions if jenson was told to let lewis pass. You along with many on these forums would be in uproar,thing is though, lewis does not need jenson to move over he would just pass without the team orders.

[billindenver]

you both saying the WMSC will go against the stewards decision that Ferrari did infact inform Massa to let Alonso through? Wishful thinking i can foresee the WMSC either taking away the win DSQ both drivers or banning them for one race.

You say this alot. Up for a wager? If that happens, I ask DD to ban my IP. If it doesn't....YOU DO. Cool?

[What's Burning?]

alonso the cheating red rat

Out of curiosity was he a cheating yellow rat last year with Renault?

[bud]

you both saying the WMSC will go against the stewards decision that Ferrari did infact inform Massa to let Alonso through? Wishful thinking i can foresee the WMSC either taking away the win DSQ both drivers or banning them for one race.

You say this alot. Up for a wager? If that happens, I ask DD to ban my IP. If it doesn't....YOU DO. Cool?

Though banning for an upcoming race will be in consideration I honestly cant see them banning Ferrari for a race afterall its Ferrari....they are special, the fans would be outraged! Unlike Honda no one cared they missed a couple! It's more than likely the sanction will be DSQ from the German race, or just loss of constructor points!

What do you think they will do? and more importantly for what purpose will this wager serve? It's rather stupid if you ask me!

[Hammer278]

Ferrari have lost the WCC anyway. There's very little chance for them there so taking away the WCC points doesn't harm them too much. Yeah, it's a punishment, but their real motive in doing what they did was with an eye on the WDC.

Strip both drivers of Hockenheim with WCC points. Let's see if they do their shenanigans again.

[Ineluke]

alonso the cheating red rat

Out of curiosity was he a cheating yellow rat last year with Renault?

Yes, being in the same team where his team mate is told to crash the car and then claiming he knowns nothing, yeah, i would say he was a yellow belly cheating rat.

[Hammer278]

Ineluke,

So he was a silver rat during the McLaren years huh? I gotta admit, a silver rat idea is still kinda cool.

[Ineluke]

Ineluke,

So he was a silver rat during the McLaren years huh? I gotta admit, a silver rat idea is still kinda cool.

Lol, i do think the colour silver is better, let's just say a cheating rat who cries like a kid in evey team he goes to.
Some thought it was just lewis but it seems eyebrows is not a team player.

[texasmr2]

Frankly I am ashamed of Ferrari for pulling that bs and blatant breach of the rules.

[MAD MAX]

Frankly I am ashamed of Ferrari for pulling that bs and blatant breach of the rules.