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[Dantif3r]

I am pretty sure you all know what race I am referring to.

It has crossed my mind on numerous occasions.. indeed it was a very disappointing result and Rubens should have won the race, but why did he let Schumacher pass him? Why did he listen to the team orders? What would have became of him had he ignored Ferrari's orders and took the race win?

Please someone answer because I am puzzled about it.

[Hansy]

I guess he would've been fired?

[Dantif3r]

I do not know why but that seems very overly harsh to me.. I mean Schumacher didnt even need that race win to get the championship and surely they realized it within the next 3 races after Austria.

[robisf1]

If he wont let Schumi win, he would be fired. Salary he got there wasnt small. car was fast...

[Jensonb]

Same reason Massa did it for Alonso when it was against the rules. If you drive for the Scuderia, and you want to keep it that way, you do whatever debasing, humiliating, awful, conniving, underhanded crap they tell you to do and afterwards you try not to cry in public.

[robisf1]

But its Ferrari politics. So nice job that there are no more that stupid rule for banning team orders...

[vaptin]

He probably would've have been sued had he not., and fired. F1 is unequal, but there are worse things for even a decent f1 driver than being number 2 in Ferrari.

Yes, I think Brawn and Todt have both openly admitted that with hindsight that they didn't need to do it. They didn't have hindsight, and I think Todt said he would've felt a lot worse had they not done it and lost the championship.

[darwin dali]

Santa wouldn't have brought him ANY presents at all

[F1er]

Because he worked for SF

[andrew]

It has crossed my mind on numerous occasions.. indeed it was a very disappointing result and Rubens should have won the race, but why did he let Schumacher pass him? Why did he listen to the team orders? What would have became of him had he ignored Ferrari's orders and took the race win?

Barriachello was hired as the No. 2 driver (ok they announced it as driver 1A and 1B along with the line "we don't have a number 1 and number 2 driver" but Barrichello was the only one who fell for this trick). It was his job to support the No. 1 driver and do what the team told him to do.

[LewEngBridewell]

Caused outrage at the time. Quite embarrassing for the whole sport really.

But then again, Ferrari are good at cooking that sort of stuff up.

[madbrad]

This era started when Schumacher came to the Scuderia for 1996 with Eddie Irvine as his willing #2. Schumacher had signed the deal early in the 95 season. Irvine saw Schumacher as a son to spoil, and conducted his races to that end, staying back and blocking Michael's rivals. It was all legal. It's a mathematical championship. If Ferrari is the only team that concentrates all its points on one driver, the the other drivers who spend the season racing each other and sharing points, can't add up to that. Of course it was also going on when he was at Benneton. Ross Brawn is the common thread here. Anyway, at the beginning of 97 Irvine predicted Schumacher would win the title. So he didn't even consider going for it himself. After a few years he got tired of that and started complaining about lack of support and left, When Rubens came aboard, they let him think they were equals. At the race in question, when he was asked in the after race press interview why he let Michael past him, he said it was because they asked him to, and that he didn't understand why they would do that, and did not hide his disappointment. He may have received a backroom tongue lashing for saying it, but later in the season Ross Brawn was letting Rubens win if he was ahead, because Michael didn't need any more wins. I think ross Brawn in his weird way was trying to engender a good personal relationship with rubens in case he needed him in the future.
What Ferrari were known for was winning titles with what they do off the track, in boardrooms and courtrooms, and with math, rather than on the track and with race skill. And that is what hurts the sport's image.

[andrew]

This era started when Schumacher came to the Scuderia for 1996 with Eddie Irvine as his willing #2. Schumacher had signed the deal early in the 95 season. Irvine saw Schumacher as a son to spoil, and conducted his races to that end, staying back and blocking Michael's rivals. It was all legal. It's a mathematical championship. If Ferrari is the only team that concentrates all its points on one driver, the the other drivers who spend the season racing each other and sharing points, can't add up to that. Of course it was also going on when he was at Benneton. Ross Brawn is the common thread here. Anyway, at the beginning of 97 Irvine predicted Schumacher would win the title. So he didn't even consider going for it himself. After a few years he got tired of that and started complaining about lack of support and left, When Rubens came aboard, they let him think they were equals. At the race in question, when he was asked in the after race press interview why he let Michael past him, he said it was because they asked him to, and that he didn't understand why they would do that, and did not hide his disappointment. He may have received a backroom tongue lashing for saying it, but later in the season Ross Brawn was letting Rubens win if he was ahead, because Michael didn't need any more wins. I think ross Brawn in his weird way was trying to engender a good personal relationship with rubens in case he needed him in the future.
What Ferrari were known for was winning titles with what they do off the track, in boardrooms and courtrooms, and with math, rather than on the track and with race skill. And that is what hurts the sport's image.

Irvine was hired as a number 2 and was doing his job. Anyway all teams used team orders but it only seems to be Ferrari, the team everyone love to hate, that gets the flak.

[smokin]

Anyway all teams used team orders but it only seems to be Ferrari, the team everyone love to hate, that gets the flak.

Ferrari get the flak because they were the ones who used team orders so brazenly (and I realise that my choice of word shows bias) and so often. It was taken as a sign of complete disdain for the spectators who'd paid to see drivers race each other. Their honest openness brought them more vilification than the teams who made their moves with more subtlety.

[andrew]

Anyway all teams used team orders but it only seems to be Ferrari, the team everyone love to hate, that gets the flak.

Ferrari get the flak because they were the ones who used team orders so brazenly (and I realise that my choice of word shows bias) and so often. It was taken as a sign of complete disdain for the spectators who'd paid to see drivers race each other. Their honest openness brought them more vilification than the teams who made their moves with more subtlety.

So what about McLaren telling Coulthard to jump out of Hakkinen's way on a few occasions? This was every bit as blatant as what Ferrari were up to.