The Best of the British

Celebrate over sixty years of F1 - your memories, experiences and opinions.

No1 British Driver Ever?

Sterling Moss
4
7%
Jackie Stewart
18
31%
Damon Hill/Graham Hill
3
5%
Nigel Mansell
7
12%
John Surtees
0
No votes
Jenson Button
2
3%
David Coulthard
4
7%
Jim Clark
17
29%
James Hunt
2
3%
Mike Hawthorn
2
3%
 
Total votes: 59

Wurnos
Posts: 15
Joined: 26 Apr 09, 10:03

Re: The Best of the British

Postby Wurnos »

darwin_dali wrote:
Wurnos wrote:Personally I would have to go for the following order using a statistical model I produced to evaluate GP Drivers.

1 Jackie Stewart 183pts
2 Jim Clark 159pts
3 Damon Hill 153pts
4 Graham Hill 141pts
5 Nigel Mansell 140pts
6. Stirling Moss 132pts
7= Lewis Hamilton 117pts
7= John Surtees 117pts
9= David Coulthard 110pts
9= Mike Hawthorn 110pts

I fully realise that Stirling Moss is rated lower on this list than in the eyes of many experts as Damon Hill is rated higher. Of course Lewis' peak rating may eventually become higher but at the moment he is 7 points below his 117 peak at 110 pts.

Only Michael Schumacher and Juan Manuel Fangio have exceeded 200 rating points based on this methodology. Ayrton Senna came close with 197pts.

Tim


Uh, and what IS your statistical model?


Multi linear regression model utilising historical performances from drivers and cars to estimate performances of drivers standardised for car performance. Of course only as good as the evidence provided and sometimes drivers can improve dramatically compared with their historical data.

This model seeks to provide an estimate of the number of points a driver would have scored at their peak had all cars been identical, had 100% relaibilty and the same level of pit support based over 25 races and where all drivers faced the same level of competition. i.e. the average standard achieved since 1950. Scores are based on 9 - 6 - 4 - 3 - 2 - 1.

I know it's not perfect but its a basic stab at providing a value added statistical assesment of performance excluding human opinion.

I guess I just like playing with numbers and thought someone might be interested. :)

Tim
User avatar
darwin dali
Forum Queen
Posts: 26937
Joined: 18 Mar 06, 02:56

Re: The Best of the British

Postby darwin dali »

Wurnos wrote:
darwin_dali wrote:
Wurnos wrote:Personally I would have to go for the following order using a statistical model I produced to evaluate GP Drivers.

1 Jackie Stewart 183pts
2 Jim Clark 159pts
3 Damon Hill 153pts
4 Graham Hill 141pts
5 Nigel Mansell 140pts
6. Stirling Moss 132pts
7= Lewis Hamilton 117pts
7= John Surtees 117pts
9= David Coulthard 110pts
9= Mike Hawthorn 110pts

I fully realise that Stirling Moss is rated lower on this list than in the eyes of many experts as Damon Hill is rated higher. Of course Lewis' peak rating may eventually become higher but at the moment he is 7 points below his 117 peak at 110 pts.

Only Michael Schumacher and Juan Manuel Fangio have exceeded 200 rating points based on this methodology. Ayrton Senna came close with 197pts.

Tim


Uh, and what IS your statistical model?


Multi linear regression model utilising historical performances from drivers and cars to estimate performances of drivers standardised for car performance. Of course only as good as the evidence provided and sometimes drivers can improve dramatically compared with their historical data.

This model seeks to provide an estimate of the number of points a driver would have scored at their peak had all cars been identical, had 100% relaibilty and the same level of pit support based over 25 races and where all drivers faced the same level of competition. i.e. the average standard achieved since 1950. Scores are based on 9 - 6 - 4 - 3 - 2 - 1.

I know it's not perfect but its a basic stab at providing a value added statistical assesment of performance excluding human opinion.

I guess I just like playing with numbers and thought someone might be interested. :)

Tim


How do you quantify pit support?
And explain 'the same level of competition' - average standard achieved since 1950?
Image Le coeur a ses raisons que la raison ne connaît point. Image
User avatar
LewEngBridewell
DD owns my a$$
Posts: 11398
Joined: 01 Apr 11, 17:04
Favourite Team: McLaren
Location: United Kingdom

Re: The Best of the British

Postby LewEngBridewell »

Old-thread-rivival-of-the-day. :D

I voted for Jackie Stewart.

He raced back in the awful days when the chances of an F1 driver who raced for 5 five years being killed in a crash were 2 out of 3. Seeing his friends dying needlessly, he campaigned endlessly for better safety regulations. This at the time was sadly largely unappreciated. But nonetheless, his stubbornness and persistence in this aspect paid dividends, and played its part in forming the much safer sport we enjoy today.

His legacy as a safety advocate is immense, as is his reputation as a brilliant race winner and champion. I have so much respect for that brilliant man. :thumbup:
Image
Race wins:181Drivers' titles:12Constructors' titles:8
Fantasy F1 Team = Bridewell Palace Racing
andrew
I disagree
Posts: 12986
Joined: 02 Apr 10, 19:39
Location: Somewhere over there

Re: The Best of the British

Postby andrew »

JIm Clark. He was a farmer, not a fan of the press and one hell of a driver.

Sadly way before my time.
User avatar
australia99
Posts: 88
Joined: 25 Feb 10, 08:26
Favourite Driver: Mika Hakkinen, Lewis Hamilton
Favourite Team: Mclaren, Williams, Mercedes
Location: Central Coast NSW

Re: The Best of the British

Postby australia99 »

andrew wrote:JIm Clark. He was a farmer, not a fan of the press and one hell of a driver.

Sadly way before my time.


that's who got my vote. he was just that much better then everyone else.
Image
User avatar
LewEngBridewell
DD owns my a$$
Posts: 11398
Joined: 01 Apr 11, 17:04
Favourite Team: McLaren
Location: United Kingdom

Re: The Best of the British

Postby LewEngBridewell »

44 years ago today. RIP Jim Clark x
Image
Race wins:181Drivers' titles:12Constructors' titles:8
Fantasy F1 Team = Bridewell Palace Racing
User avatar
scotty
Posts: 9319
Joined: 11 Oct 07, 18:49
Favourite Driver: My GCSE Chemistry Teacher John Driver
Location: Degner 1

Re: The Best of the British

Postby scotty »

RIP indeed. Arguably the greatest of all time, regardless of nationality.

(Top 3 Brits ever - Clark, Stewart and Mansell in that order...)
Rising number one of Formula 1, Juan - Juan, one wonders should Juan only win one Formula 1 one year, would Juan have won that one in round one, Juan??
User avatar
Blackavar
Posts: 196
Joined: 01 Mar 12, 17:27
Location: Location, Location.

Re: The Best of the British

Postby Blackavar »

Eddie Irvine.
Ayrton Senna is God
Posts: 77
Joined: 22 Dec 10, 21:57

Re: The Best of the British

Postby Ayrton Senna is God »

Two Scots first and second :D
FAVOURITE CONSTRUCTERS 1. Sauber 2. Ferrari 3. Lotus
FAVOURITE DRIVERS 1. Kimi Raikkonen 2. Fernando Alonso 3. Sergio Perez/Paul di Resta 5. Jenson Button/Kamui Kobayashi
andrew
I disagree
Posts: 12986
Joined: 02 Apr 10, 19:39
Location: Somewhere over there

Re: The Best of the British

Postby andrew »

Why are Graham and Damon Hill lumped together? From what I've seen and read I'd say that Graham Hill was a hell of a lot better than his son. I know polls only allow 10 options but maybe one of the less inspiring British drivers listed could have been omitted.
User avatar
LewEngBridewell
DD owns my a$$
Posts: 11398
Joined: 01 Apr 11, 17:04
Favourite Team: McLaren
Location: United Kingdom

Re: The Best of the British

Postby LewEngBridewell »

andrew wrote:Why are Graham and Damon Hill lumped together? From what I've seen and read I'd say that Graham Hill was a hell of a lot better than his son. I know polls only allow 10 options but maybe one of the less inspiring British drivers listed could have been omitted.


Less inspiring? Damon Hill? He's a bloody champion for goodness sake, and might have been a double one had he not been the victim of a certain German's road rage! :P:whip:
Image
Race wins:181Drivers' titles:12Constructors' titles:8
Fantasy F1 Team = Bridewell Palace Racing
andrew
I disagree
Posts: 12986
Joined: 02 Apr 10, 19:39
Location: Somewhere over there

Re: The Best of the British

Postby andrew »

LewEngBridewell wrote:
andrew wrote:Why are Graham and Damon Hill lumped together? From what I've seen and read I'd say that Graham Hill was a hell of a lot better than his son. I know polls only allow 10 options but maybe one of the less inspiring British drivers listed could have been omitted.


Less inspiring? Damon Hill? He's a bloody champion for goodness sake, and might have been a double one had he not been the victim of a certain German's road rage! :P:whip:


Best car in 94, 95 and 96 yet only managed to get the championship in 96 when the only real ompetition was his team mate who was often faster.
User avatar
LewEngBridewell
DD owns my a$$
Posts: 11398
Joined: 01 Apr 11, 17:04
Favourite Team: McLaren
Location: United Kingdom

Re: The Best of the British

Postby LewEngBridewell »

andrew wrote:
LewEngBridewell wrote:
andrew wrote:Why are Graham and Damon Hill lumped together? From what I've seen and read I'd say that Graham Hill was a hell of a lot better than his son. I know polls only allow 10 options but maybe one of the less inspiring British drivers listed could have been omitted.


Less inspiring? Damon Hill? He's a bloody champion for goodness sake, and might have been a double one had he not been the victim of a certain German's road rage! :P:whip:


Best car in 94, 95 and 96 yet only managed to get the championship in 96 when the only real ompetition was his team mate who was often faster.


With regard to '96 it's the points that matter at the end of the day! :twisted: He's a champion and you can't argue with that.
Image
Race wins:181Drivers' titles:12Constructors' titles:8
Fantasy F1 Team = Bridewell Palace Racing
andrew
I disagree
Posts: 12986
Joined: 02 Apr 10, 19:39
Location: Somewhere over there

Re: The Best of the British

Postby andrew »

LewEngBridewell wrote:
andrew wrote:
LewEngBridewell wrote:
andrew wrote:Why are Graham and Damon Hill lumped together? From what I've seen and read I'd say that Graham Hill was a hell of a lot better than his son. I know polls only allow 10 options but maybe one of the less inspiring British drivers listed could have been omitted.


Less inspiring? Damon Hill? He's a bloody champion for goodness sake, and might have been a double one had he not been the victim of a certain German's road rage! :P:whip:


Best car in 94, 95 and 96 yet only managed to get the championship in 96 when the only real ompetition was his team mate who was often faster.


With regard to '96 it's the points that matter at the end of the day! :twisted: He's a champion and you can't argue with that.


Yeah, thank goodness for team orders. Villeneuve would have beat by a long way otherwise!
User avatar
LewEngBridewell
DD owns my a$$
Posts: 11398
Joined: 01 Apr 11, 17:04
Favourite Team: McLaren
Location: United Kingdom

Re: The Best of the British

Postby LewEngBridewell »

andrew wrote:
LewEngBridewell wrote:
andrew wrote:
LewEngBridewell wrote:
andrew wrote:Why are Graham and Damon Hill lumped together? From what I've seen and read I'd say that Graham Hill was a hell of a lot better than his son. I know polls only allow 10 options but maybe one of the less inspiring British drivers listed could have been omitted.


Less inspiring? Damon Hill? He's a bloody champion for goodness sake, and might have been a double one had he not been the victim of a certain German's road rage! :P:whip:


Best car in 94, 95 and 96 yet only managed to get the championship in 96 when the only real ompetition was his team mate who was often faster.


With regard to '96 it's the points that matter at the end of the day! :twisted: He's a champion and you can't argue with that.


Yeah, thank goodness for team orders. Villeneuve would have beat by a long way otherwise!


Well, let's not start another conspiracy debate about what could've been :hehe::wink:
Image
Race wins:181Drivers' titles:12Constructors' titles:8
Fantasy F1 Team = Bridewell Palace Racing