FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[CookinFlat6]

Thats why I dont see how the privacy issue has to be added to the mix of what is already a fine line between letting kids be kids yet understanding as an adult that youth is wasted on the young. I still insist that its irresponsible to suggest parents should not take every measure possible to protect their kids which has always included covert 'snapshots' of what they are up to. So teach the kids to manage the risk, and at the same time be ready to covertly breach their right to absolute privacy to add the extra layer of security that bypasses a kids instinct to do 'their own thing'
All I can see is a parent now having to worry about checking up on their kid, cross checking what they say, covertly protecting them for fear of causing the kid issues of trust etc

You are at restaurant with a kids play area, and you need to worry about not been able to have a quick look to see all is good without informing the kid first??

Maybe this discussion was meant to be more 'fuzzy logic' and not fixed on what was originally said, and that there are parents out there who are worrying more about letting their kids have complete carte blanche on the web for fear of invading their privacy overtly or covertly

[racechick]

If you can spare a minute, take a look at this. It's a short film to demonstrate remote monitoring of mobile devices. It's a product from IMPERO, who Produce software for E safety in schools. ( Nikki is marketing manager and responsible for the film) let me know what you guys think.

[youtube]http://le7JnfrvsRA[/youtube]

[CookinFlat6]

Great film, really good story. The product looks ok from what they show of it.

I hope it comes with child therapy support for the times the kid doesn't notice teacher is curious. I didn't see the part where the teacher told each pupil before hand he was checking

[racechick]

I can get the nitty gritty. From what I know, kids who know the school run IMPERO software hate it because they can't crack it. What a challenge!!

[sagi58]

If you can spare a minute, take a look at this. It's a short film to demonstrate remote monitoring of mobile devices. It's a product from IMPERO, who Produce software for E safety in schools. ( Nikki is marketing manager and responsible for the film) let me know what you guys think.

Nicely done!!

[CookinFlat6]

:rofl: I can get the nitty gritty. From what I know, kids who know the school run IMPERO software hate it because they can't crack it. What a challenge!!

Having watched it a second time, Its clear what aspect of the software is been sold subtly to intelligent teachers/parents

Namely, the teacher has full access to everything the kids are doing on their mobile devices, and the kids know this, however it still takes a massive anomaly in the teacher/pupil relationship for the teacher to have to exercise this ability to covertly check their activity that they have clearfully hidden (by drawing curtains etc) and the ONLY way he can bypass all these kid tricks (curtains, slamming doors) is to use this software to bypass and check

But he is only forced to do this as a last resort, and because of a weakness that makes him all too human - a need to feel loved and appreciated - not because of the teacher vs pupil power.

very clever film, hats off to Nikki and whoever wrote the story

[stonemonkey]

Namely, the teacher has full access to everything the kids are doing on their mobile devices

What! Maybe i'm not quite getting it but in the wrong hands couldnt that be used so the wrong way?

Edit: Just looked it up and it can give access to whats on their screen, their emails and other social medua use. I can understand parents having that kind of access but i would definitely not want anyone else to have that kind of access if i had kids.

[racechick]

Thanks for the feedback, I'll pass it on. Nikki will be pleased .
Remember Stonemonkey, if this is used in school it will be on school devices, they use iPads a lot in schools now. What happens on private devices is up to parents, but in school teachers have a responsibility to safeguard the pupils.

[stonemonkey]

Ah ok, i was thinking that they were using their own devices through the network. Still, i hope they are made well aware that if they check their email or enter a password to log in to something or anything like that at all, that it can all be monitored.

[CookinFlat6]

You couldnt see password input fields. You only see what the pupil is seeing. I think the point here that was clouded under the deluge of angst is that technology like the internet is a potential danger, however technology also provides the ability to keep kids safe by providing the access and monitoring that any parent does in real life. And we should not be clouding this with talk of upsetting the kids feelings by not trusting them enough to remain unsupervised by any means possible

This videos message is that the software gives that added layer of monitoring that can be used as sparing or as much as the parent needs, but is there. Any parent who is gonna use it to steal their kids passwords etc will do other such things anyway.

but parents who worry about the kids inadvertently or otherwise breaching safeguards and falling into the wrong spaces or chatting with 'John' who says he is 10 year old but has his own place, can now check if they spot any patterns or just want the ability to do spot checks randomly.

Telling the kid before you do the random spot check, to not breach privacy or issues of trust, is just stupid

[stonemonkey]

It can monitor keystrokes so could give access to passwords.

Schools have every right to monitor activity over their network but this would seem to allow far more access than i would consider anyone but parents should have unless the kids themselves completely restrict their activity while on it and dont use it for any personal use at all.

It may be few and far between but some people with an unhealthy interest in kids make it into professions and activities like teaching and scoutleading because it gives them access to kids, would you really want to risk someone like that having access to see communication between your kids and their friends discussing what they're doing at the weekends and stuff?

Maybe im just paranoid but if i was a parent that would be a concern for me, that such a system that's meant to keep kids safe could be used in other ways if the wrong person gets their hands on it.

[racechick]

I'll ask Nikki for clarity on what the software actually does.

I have mixed feelings on this. The thing is, if children behave inappropriately at school they are reprimanded for it, told not to do it.They may still try it, but they know it's wrong so it's fair cop if they gat caught. Smoking, drugs, bullying,sneaking off premises etc etc. Same online in my opinion. If they know what they shouldn't do/ where they shouldnt go, online during school time, then they shouldn't be surprised that they're monitored. . I would tell children they're monitored and why they're monitored.
To me it's not about catching them out, it's about preventing them getting into unsafe situations.

[racechick]

Nikki replied with following.............it's an OFSTED requirement to take a managed approach to esafety which meant monitoring and controling what kids are doing online. Pretty much all UK schools have classroom management software on pc's (which is what impero does) but with the rise of mobile devices this is new mobile functionality that not many other products have yet. The only people with access is teachers and they are already in a position of trust with access to far more confidential information than what they may see on a student's screen.


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[CookinFlat6]

That makes sense RC. Only their teachers will have access, and kids should be using it for anything other than educational stuff anyway. And ofcourse parents should therefore be 100% comfortable with deploying such a system on their kids personal pcs because no one else but the parent will control it - which brings us back to the original premise - should parents covertly check on kids? covert = kid knows about the system but doesnt know exactly when the parent might have a look. This right of the parent should never ever be discontinued on the grounds of breaching trust or other sillyness.

And Stoner does have a very good point in that the school is actually a more potentially "dangerous" place for this to be deployed than at home by the parents because of the question I mentioned earlier - are pedos attracted to priesthood because of the easy access to choir boys etc, or do priests get attracted to being a pedo because of the easy access etc

Asking oneself this question of every adult in a position of responsibility round their kids is therefore essential - does that babysitter enjoy babysitting or something else, does that teacher love teaching or something else. (apologies to the teachers in the house) - Once you answered that to your satisfaction as you would even without computers THEN you can stop worrying about letting the teachers have this access

IMHO

- And dont forget that a benefit of the system would be only the teacher has the viewer password, and its not written on the wall in the staffroom for the janitor etc - plus there is logging detail of each access and when, what was seen etc etc

[stonemonkey]

Yep RC, but that confidential information doesn't say what kids are going to be doing that evening or weekend, where and when they're going somewhere and who with or what personal problems they're having or anything else going on in their lives at that moment which could easily be in a personal email and if just one wrong person had access to that sort of information it would be extremely dangerous in my opinion.
I know teachers are in a position of trust and thats not a problem for the vast majority but when i was at school there were 2 teachers sacked for inappropriate behaviour towards girls in my class, they'd been teaching there for years and it wasn't separate incidents, they were acting together and i dont think it's much of a stretch of the imagination to think that had they had access to such a system that they'd have made as much use of the information available as they could. So i wouldn't want my kids communicating anything other than purely schoolwork over such a network and not to do anything like just checking their emails or messages or anything on it, the problem there being that most of the time kids will have limited or expensive data plans on their own mobile devices and would prefer to use an available network.

Is there anyone monitoring the teachers?