FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[andrew]

Beating up other Muslims isn't going to solve anything or bring back the dead.

Behaving like feral animals (and supporting them in such acts) is just as bad as the guys who murdered the lad.

The way forward is to educate that not all Muslims are murderous nut-jobs and acts of terrorism and pointless killing are not restricted to just one religion.

[vaptin]

Beating up other Muslims isn't going to solve anything or bring back the dead.

Behaving like feral animals (and supporting them in such acts) is just as bad as the guys who murdered the lad.

The way forward is to educate that not all Muslims are murderous nut-jobs and acts of terrorism and pointless killing are not restricted to just one religion.

Exactly, and to look into specifically, what causes people to kill other people, and how best to alleviate that, because to be honest, I'm not so sure the government is going to get that right, nor the public or the media.

And I suppose, to apply this to all problems, making people feel "under threat", from a certain group, especially on pretty nationalistic grounds (separating Nation and the state!) is an easy thing to make into a big story etc.

I reckon more people die of suicide for instance, in the UK than terrorism for instance.

[andrew]

Beating up other Muslims isn't going to solve anything or bring back the dead.

Behaving like feral animals (and supporting them in such acts) is just as bad as the guys who murdered the lad.

The way forward is to educate that not all Muslims are murderous nut-jobs and acts of terrorism and pointless killing are not restricted to just one religion.

Exactly, and to look into specifically, what causes people to kill other people, and how best to alleviate that, because to be honest, I'm not so sure the government is going to get that right, nor the public or the media.

And I suppose, to apply this to all problems, making people feel "under threat", from a certain group, especially on pretty nationalistic grounds (separating Nation and the state!) is an easy thing to make into a big story etc.

I reckon more people die of suicide for instance, in the UK than terrorism for instance.

More innocent people have died in Afghanistan and Iraq than in terrorism in the UK. I guess it all depends on who is doing the act.

[vaptin]

Beating up other Muslims isn't going to solve anything or bring back the dead.

Behaving like feral animals (and supporting them in such acts) is just as bad as the guys who murdered the lad.

The way forward is to educate that not all Muslims are murderous nut-jobs and acts of terrorism and pointless killing are not restricted to just one religion.

Exactly, and to look into specifically, what causes people to kill other people, and how best to alleviate that, because to be honest, I'm not so sure the government is going to get that right, nor the public or the media.

And I suppose, to apply this to all problems, making people feel "under threat", from a certain group, especially on pretty nationalistic grounds (separating Nation and the state!) is an easy thing to make into a big story etc.

I reckon more people die of suicide for instance, in the UK than terrorism for instance.

More innocent people have died in Afghanistan and Iraq than in terrorism in the UK. I guess it all depends on who is doing the act.

True, I can go around posting various articles that involve people being killed, it's true people are pretty culturally biased, but I don't want to give the impression I am uninterested in or dis-compassionate about ones of this type, but I guess it's important to look at all different types too.

Anyway,

1. Media coverage I think has to change, I think they need to change (or rather, the consumer needs to demand a change). No need to make everyone so upset, and well, I suspect the way they interview witnesses, people directly involved and the like, causes those people emotional distress. It also, well, tends to massively skewer the public's reaction to events and the like, which goes to affect politicians (since we live in a short-termist democracy) and I think, just in general, upsets people more than they need to be. No need to be so graphic about everything, sure they do it because it makes people buy it, so the solution is for the public to stop buying it. And longer term, for the government to ensure the populace are educated on principles of consumerism, capitalism etc. since everyone is pretty much forced to consent to such a society (personally I like capitalism and stuff, just think it relies on a populace who know what it is, and what it involves on their part)

2. The Governments reaction, http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22670184 to be honest, I think they need to drill down further, what makes people susceptible to extremism? What are the long term factors? This smacks to me of, prohibition.

Quite simply, what is stopping or turning people from values of human compassion, respect for life etc. and the like that society relies upon, and why do they either not posses these values innately, or turn away from them to extremism?

All this is asking, is for someone to work out how to get people "extremist" in a way not picked up by the government, which to be honest I think is pretty possible.

Problem is, the public demand tangible solutions, ones with a "physical presence".

Also, to be honest I haven't looked much up, but terrorism, religious terrorism, nationalistic terrorism, extremist whatever, is nothing new, there's probably plenty of material on how best to tackle it etc. historical case studies etc. I don't see why that isn't being reported in the media, that'd be far more informative.

[bud]

Reprisals are going to be terrible. I would imagine that the troops at woolwich are going to be locked down tonight. If not they will be like feral animals, and who would blame them.

Well, I would.

---

I think, if we really wanted to solve issues, we should take a statistically, reasoned approach to them, not just focus on the most emotional responses? Sadly, I think all the way up to the heads of government, and civil service, and the military, it isn't working like that.

I think, caring about the issue isn't enough, no point getting emotional about it, the key is to actually work out the most effective way of dealing with it, and providing a better way for society to move forward.

You would blame them? A fellow soldier was randomly run down because of his uniform then hacked to death by a pair of barbaric pieces of s*** all in the name of a stupid religion.

I'm sorry I would find that very hard not to get emotional about!

[What's Burning?]

Maybe it's just god's plan?

[vaptin]

Reprisals are going to be terrible. I would imagine that the troops at woolwich are going to be locked down tonight. If not they will be like feral animals, and who would blame them.

Well, I would.

---

I think, if we really wanted to solve issues, we should take a statistically, reasoned approach to them, not just focus on the most emotional responses? Sadly, I think all the way up to the heads of government, and civil service, and the military, it isn't working like that.

I think, caring about the issue isn't enough, no point getting emotional about it, the key is to actually work out the most effective way of dealing with it, and providing a better way for society to move forward.

You would blame them? A fellow soldier was randomly run down because of his uniform then hacked to death by a pair of barbaric pieces of s*** all in the name of a stupid religion.

I'm sorry I would find that very hard not to get emotional about!

It hardly solves any issues though, lynch mobs or whatever. It isn't the best way, to prevent stuff like this happening in the future, and I'm not psychologist, but I highly doubt it is the best way to emotionally deal with it, even if it seems the easiest.

And well, I think people who are soldiers, ought to have strong control of their emotions with regards to violence or whatever.

[Jabberwocky]

who said it was the right way to deal with it. However until you spend time in uniform you do not realize how close a bond you have with your comrades. when you have to trust people with your life day in and day out they become closer than family.

now can you imagine how you would feel if a close relative had, been randomly picked and killed in such a way. Now imagine how your family would react? now imagine if your family was a few hundreds battle seasoned soldiers!

[vaptin]

who said it was the right way to deal with it. However until you spend time in uniform you do not realize how close a bond you have with your comrades. when you have to trust people with your life day in and day out they become closer than family.

now can you imagine how you would feel if a close relative had, been randomly picked and killed in such a way. Now imagine how your family would react? now imagine if your family was a few hundreds battle seasoned soldiers!

Well, if it's not right, then its wrong. . .

[What's Burning?]

[youtube]PL1jDcAHkc8[/youtube]

[LewEngBridewell]

Ugghhhh that video is HORRID. I almost didn't dare click play. That guy needs to seriously go back to school, and it sums up PRECISELY the uneducated attitudes of organisations like the EDL, the BNP, and UKIP. Yes, UKIP.

[racechick]

And by not dealing with these clerics through the proper channels( which I believe the government are now addressing) more power goes to morons like in that video. And more mainstream people have support for UKIP

[LewEngBridewell]

And by not dealing with these clerics through the proper channels( which I believe the government are now addressing) more power goes to morons like in that video. And more mainstream people have support for UKIP

UKIP is an interesting one. It's a fiercely right-wing, racist party that was initially a cesspit of disgruntled Tories, who felt the centre-drifting Conservative party was going too soft. Now, being the biggest anti-immigration, pro-religion, anti-gay party, a lot of bigoted jerks vote for them, but also people who have lost faith in their main party politics. And that is the tragedy of it all.

UKIP soared in the previous local elections however, some years ago now. Come the general elections, they'll likely dip again.

[andrew]

And by not dealing with these clerics through the proper channels( which I believe the government are now addressing) more power goes to morons like in that video. And more mainstream people have support for UKIP

UKIP is an interesting one. It's a fiercely right-wing, racist party that was initially a cesspit of disgruntled Tories, who felt the centre-drifting Conservative party was going too soft. Now, being the biggest anti-immigration, pro-religion, anti-gay party, a lot of bigoted jerks vote for them, but also people who have lost faith in their main party politics. And that is the tragedy of it all.

UKIP soared in the previous local elections however, some years ago now. Come the general elections, they'll likely dip again.

Some of what UKIP says make perfect sense. Their stance on health, inheritance tax and immigration are very sensible.

[LewEngBridewell]

And by not dealing with these clerics through the proper channels( which I believe the government are now addressing) more power goes to morons like in that video. And more mainstream people have support for UKIP

UKIP is an interesting one. It's a fiercely right-wing, racist party that was initially a cesspit of disgruntled Tories, who felt the centre-drifting Conservative party was going too soft. Now, being the biggest anti-immigration, pro-religion, anti-gay party, a lot of bigoted jerks vote for them, but also people who have lost faith in their main party politics. And that is the tragedy of it all.

UKIP soared in the previous local elections however, some years ago now. Come the general elections, they'll likely dip again.

Some of what UKIP says make perfect sense. Their stance on health, inheritance tax and immigration are very sensible.

Even Professor Alan Sked, who founded UKIP in the early 90s, thinks the party is a shambles:

“My great regret is that the party I founded has been captured by the radical Right and has gone all anti-intellectual. It’s gone completely fruitcake.”
Prof Sked also mocked an idea recently put forward by Ukip’s deputy leader Godfrey Bloom, that the party could “buy” policies from right-wing think tanks.
“Why - are they too stupid to think any up?” the academic said, sitting an office where bookcases seven shelves high groan with historical tomes.
Ukip’s founder believes the party’s agenda is too narrow to win mass support at a general election. The party’s performance has been flattered by a turnout of just 31 per cent, Prof Sked argues.
He suspects that while Ukip has picked up disaffected Conservative supporters in rural shires, it will struggle in metropolitan areas and at the general election.
“The Liberals’ entry into government has robbed them of their status as a protest party,” he said. “That has helped Ukip.”
Prof Sked also dismisses claims that a surge of party membership to 25,800 represents a “breakthrough”. The party’s membership stood at 26,000 nine years ago.
“Ukip is for many people a stick to beat David Cameron with,” he added. “That’s what a lot of this is about.”