F1 vs Le Mans LMP cars

[2012 Boss 302]

First a hearty hello from Houston,TX.

Why aren't there Diesel Hybrids in F1 like some of the LMP cars. I was watching the 24 hour race this past weekend and was just amazed at the Audi R18.

[acosmichippo]

Short answer: engines in F1 are strictly regulated to reduce development costs as much as possible. The last few years, their development has been frozen altogether, and will remain so until 2014, although even then they pretty much have to stay within a strict petrol formula.

[Jabberwocky]

nice avatar by the way

[Hammer278]

nice avatar by the way

+1

[LewEngBridewell]

nice avatar by the way

+1

+2

[What's Burning?]

I heard a blurb Sunday that in 2014 or was it 2013 they're going to completely remove ALL engine restrictions in the LMP1 cars, just limit the amount of fuel available each race.

That sounds familiar.

[Frontrunner]

nice avatar by the way

+1

+2

+3

[What's Burning?]

More technical discussion and less breasteses discussion por favor. There's a thread for that here.

[stonemonkey]

I would much rather see no limits on size or how much they're allowed to modify them, anyway yeah, back to engines, I'd like to see F1 going that way too WB.

[What's Burning?]

I would much rather see no limits on size or how much they're allowed to modify them, anyway yeah, back to engines, I'd like to see F1 going that way too WB.

well done sir.

[scotty]

First a hearty hello from Houston,TX.

Why aren't there Diesel Hybrids in F1 like some of the LMP cars. I was watching the 24 hour race this past weekend and was just amazed at the Audi R18.

Diesel would never be allowed in F1 cause of the lack of noise... F1 is a bit up it's own backside like that. But either way, given the nature of F1 races at under 2 hours versus endurance races, then the diesel mileage benefit would not have so much an effect in F1. I still believe petrol engines have more power potential (the diesel speed advantage in LMP is a product of how the regulations benefit them rather than a natural advantage, imo) and F1 is really still going to just be about power, unless massive regulation changes were to be made (on top of the 2014 changes).

LMP is going a very good direction in terms of engines though, new regulations are due to come into force with MUCH more emphasis being put on energy recovery but with relative freedom given elsewhere. I believe this will attract more manufacturers to LMP1, something that is harder to see happening with F1's new regulations.

I agree that the R18 is one amazing racing car though, it was incredible watching the onboard footage from the hybrid cars at LM.

[What's Burning?]

For racing, in energy recovery, my long term money is on flywheels rather than batteries but it's yet too early to tell. When do the new LMP1 regulations take effect in 2013 or 2014? It was confirmed, not just rumored that the Nissan delta wing folks were meeting with the Audi folks during the race.

[scotty]

New regs 2014, here's the article i read it in:

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/article/ ... announced/

The Automobile Club de l'Ouest, along with the FIA, announced Thursday the new technical regulations for LMP1 cars, which will go into effect in 2014.

Focusing heavily on efficiency, cost reduction and safety, the new-look category will comprise entirely of closed-top prototypes, with a reduced weight of 830 kg (850 kg for non-hybrids) and 10 cm narrower than the current-spec machines.

There will also be an improvement in male chicken visibility, following a series of high-speed accidents over recent years involving traffic, with the driver now sitting higher in the car and further forward. It has resulted in a 90 mm taller male chicken/greenhouse area.

Another change comes with a simplified nose element that will be adjustable to each specific downforce configuration, instead of having separate bodywork for different aerodynamic configurations.

While wheel tethers will also become mandatory, along with lateral protection panels and a rear crash box, manufacturers will now have two choices of bodywork cut-outs, either above the wheels (as introduced this year) or on the inside fenders (new for 2014). The dorsal fin will remain on the top-tier prototypes.

Perhaps the biggest change, however, comes with the engine rules, as there will be no limit in cubic capacity for the conventional power plants. Air restrictors and turbo pressures have been eliminated and replaced by a fuel meter, which restricts the allocation of gasoline or diesel according to a predetermined level.

The ACO targets up to a 30 percent reduction in fuel consumption with its new system, which sees five different base configurations, largely dependent on the size of the hybrid systems.

For example: privateers, which are limited to 5.5-liter capacity engines, will be allocated 4.95 liters of gasoline (or 3.99 liters of diesel) per a lap of Le Mans. Fuel capacity would be limited to 64.4 liters for gasoline (53.3 liters for diesel), roughly a 11-14 percent decrease over 2012 fuel capacity levels.

In the situation of hybrids, four different sizes of energy recovery systems will be permitted, ranging from 2 to 8 MJ of power. It's a significant increase over the current hybrid regulations, which are limited to 0.5 MJs. In effect, a larger system will be required to be more fuel efficient.

Of note, all factory entries will be required to compete with hybrid systems, which will be homologated on a seasonal basis, eliminating evolutions over the course of a year.

"Thanks to in-depth work and excellent collaboration, today, the ACO and the FIA have announced a unique set of extremely innovative technical regulations for 2014 that are in phase with the times we live in," said Sir Lindsay Owen-Jones, FIA Endurance Commission President.

"It should encourage the development of powerful and spectacular cars and also the development of technologies that have real meaning for the everyday motorist. Private teams haven't been forgotten either with simple but competitive alternatives."

The LMP1 technical regulations will be used in the FIA World Endurance Championship and American Le Mans Series beginning in 2014. A one-year grandfathering period for current-spec machinery is being evaluated by the ACO for the first year.

[stonemonkey]

lol

There will also be an improvement in male chicken visibility, following a series of high-speed accidents over recent years involving traffic, with the driver now sitting higher in the car and further forward. It has resulted in a 90 mm taller male chicken/greenhouse area.

Yep, those taller chickens will be easier to see.

It should encourage the development of powerful and spectacular cars and also the development of technologies that have real meaning for the everyday motorist.

Although it could be costly to the teams, that could have large worldwide benefits.

[scotty]

Heh, stupid overreactive swear filter strikes again...

but yes, your last point is exactly why i think it'll encourage more manufacturers. They can handle the cost if it's worth it elsewhere in their company.